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Should Creationism be taught in Schools? (Science in particular)

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Countess_Vampira:
Good evening My fellow forum-er’s I’d like to firstly thank you all for your contribution very interesting ideas indeed and I’d like if I may to take the time to address a few replies

Princess Muni: “what do you mean by I don't take quranic verses literally?”

By that I mean, I don’t take the descriptions of human and the how the earth was created in the quran literally, meaning….I cannot see how humans were produced directly from clay. Again…Like I’ve said before people, its not that I believe that Allah cannot accomplish such a feat nor do I insinuate they we were not created exactly as was described to us by the Rahim it just means that I wish to know exactly how the universe, us and thus all of creation has come to be precisely.

Therfore we cannot use the Quran as a kind of substitute for a scientific journal, the Quran is a guideline, a poetically produced piece of perfection indeed but its by no means detailed. There are other areas in the quran which describes human creation in the form of a water/liquid based organism- first clay then water? Can you people not see for yourself the great areas of differences there are? The large areas of translation? Does that mean we come from water? Or directly from clay? ...if so what was in this clay for it to create life?

See? There are too many blank questions and pages that the Quran cannot file, that’s why we have science that’s why Allah gave us minds to question and so we can seek further knowledge.

There is a difference in having faith and then trying to provide evidence for the idea of faith, that’s why I believe that those children should be aware of the different ideas of creation we should all be sensible and look towards the one idea that can provide evidence placing it all into content. My proposition is simple and I’m not sure as to why it would be a difficult concept to comprehend.

People how is it haram to say I take things symbolically? The world was created in six days or periods….do I take that literally? Or symbolically? Does Allah require the sun to keep time like we do? Obviously no as he is the creator of time itself. See? Questions after questions after questions

There is nothing blasphemous about what I’ve said and I think that people are being selective.

Did you all not read this part?

I personally differ from other traditionalists like my grandmother and indeed some aunts and uncles is that I don't take the Quranic verses of the universe/worlds creation literally but symbolically. Why? Because being scientifically minded the idea of creating humans from clay/earth is hard to get my head around. That’s not to suggest that Allah cannot create humans in such a manner or indeed (has not created them as such) for I have no quarrel with Allah's ability in producing anything. Its just that being human I have a deficiency in understanding things which are greater than my cerebral capabilities and thus it is a great possibility that Allah has merely expressed to us the idea of creation in the simplest of terms.

^- Please try to at least take my view point into consideration before you start waving the Kufar flag, now that would be unislamic.


To Dr Farabeen- I never said I DON’T BELIEVE! I said I find it difficult to understand HOW it is done, can you not see the clear difference? Can you say to me that you understand and know precisely how humans were created? That you can describe to me in detail how we were formed? What type of clay was used? What was in the clay? What entities were used to produce us? Biologically/chemically speaking? No…you merely have a symbolic description given to you which has been simplified for your simple human mind (like my simple human mind)

Therefore I want to know exactly how we came to be and question and seek truth and knowledge. Human beings are inquisitive creators Allah understands our thirst for knowledge and thus it is not HARAM to question or to try to figure out the mysteries of the world.

You can’t get as clear as that.


 

PrincessMuni:
Istaqfur Allah

To Dr Farabeen- I never said I DON’T BELIEVE! I said I find it difficult to understand HOW it is done, can you not see the clear difference? Can you say to me that you understand and know precisely how humans were created? That you can describe to me in detail how we were formed?

why its difficult to understand, as a matter of fact you don't have to
as they mentioned earlier go back to Quran and try to read and understand
there is also translation to everything in Quran, you don't need to wonder!
this is crazy.
all these ppl agree that what you're saying is wrong, does that mean that you're the only person who is right?
I see this conversation is going no where so therefore i quit!
good luck with finding the answers and be careful, dont commit suicide
if you don't get all the answers and wonders you want to know ok?
This is DRAMA, our sister is seeking for attention!!!

don't take my words literally but symbolically OK?!  ??? :-X :-\ ???

Countess_Vampira:
^- Now I’m attention seeking? For simply raising a question and expressing my opinions and ideas?

I can see this is going into semantics and if your last reply is an indication of your mood your going to become juvenile, so before it gets out of hand I'd say that if you’ve nothing else but invectives to contribute I’d like to respectfully ask that you remain silent and agree to disagree. If we cannot speak like adults I’d rather not bicker, I do believe that I’ve made myself clear.

Ps Well of course I have to wonder and NEED to understand, how on earth can we develop as a species and increase our knowledge through the passion of discovery? Do we stop asking questions about history, science, astronomy? No…thinking and asking questions goes hand in hand with humanity and Allah himself mentions the importance of Climi within the quran so I fail to see where your coming from.

Dr.Farabadan:
 Dear Countess_Vampira.

If you are attention seeker, you will find avery thing you need from the Korran. all the science that they said they have invented was discovered before them in the Holly Korran. and the alot of western scientists who read Korran and compared what they descoverd and what they saw in a korran , accepted Islam.

You said "I find it difficult to understand"  so I say to you Koran is not difficult to understand. Allah said about the creation of the haven and the earth

And it is We who have constructed the heaven with might, and verily, it is We who are steadily expanding it." (The Qur'an, 51:47)

you hear expansion of the universe allah said talking about that.

"And it is We who have constructed the heaven with might, and verily, it is We who are steadily expanding it." (The Qur'an, 51:47)
Allah also said about the creation of the Universe.
"It is He Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. They swim along, each in an orbit. " (The Qur'an, 21:33)

allah also said about the days and nights.

He has created the Heavens and the Earth for Truth. He wraps the night up in the day, and wraps the day up in the night." (The Qur'an, 39:5)

My dear Countess_Vampira.

Allah made simple for truth-seeker. so, it is not far from you,  you will find the truth keep seeking it, but seek from the book of allah not anly shaydan books.

Go to this Link, I think It will help you.

http://www.creationofuniverse.com/

PrincessMuni:

--- Quote from: Countess_Vampira on September 13, 2008, 10:03:10 PM ---^- Now I'm attention seeking? For simply raising a question and expressing my opinions and ideas?

I can see this is going into semantics and if your last reply is an indication of your mood your going to become juvenile, so before it gets out of hand I'd say that if you've nothing else but invectives to contribute I'd like to respectfully ask that you remain silent and agree to disagree. If we cannot speak like adults I'd rather not bicker, I do believe that I've made myself clear.

PS Well of course I have to wonder and NEED to understand, how on earth can we develop as a species and increase our knowledge through the passion of discovery? Do we stop asking questions about history, science, astronomy? No…thinking and asking questions goes hand in hand with humanity and Allah himself mentions the importance of Climi within the quran so I fail to see where your coming from.

--- End quote ---

I see you took my words literally not symbolically,
I just wanted to show you that what you're saying is wrong because when you said I don't take quran literally but symbolically, EVERYONE TOOK YOUR WORDS LITERALLY
I wrote that sentence to see your reaction, you seem to disagree with your own Idea!
AND I rather stay silent and leave the page than reading your drama
and one more thing, my mood is Excellent , my mood never change for such drama
and am not bickering + I am sure that I am adult, I think like adult
but do you?

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